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steviesbicrisis · 1 year

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Stranger Things S2 rewatch thoughts

I finally finished rewatching S2 and this is everything I've written down as I was watching lmao

KEITH USED TO WORK AT THE ARCADE?? Also the arcade is right next to family video so Keith just moved next door in season 3 lmao

Steve omg you’re so cute stop

FINALLY MAX IS HERE

Okay Billie is bad, yes? We all agree Billie is bad, right? But Dacre IS SO HOT I CANNOT HE TOOK A “PORCA TROIA” OUT OF ME LIKE IT WAS NOTHING

Honestly they’re so dope for dressing up as ghostbusters and going to school with matching outfits

Ugh Nancy and Steve are so terrible for each other

Steve’s face during the bullshit scene really broke my heart 🥺

People being annoyed at Joyce for being super protective of Will like what?? That boy was proclaimed dead, they had a funeral and he turned out to be in another dimension??? I dare you to not be at least a little paranoid

I’m getting the gayest vibes ever from this basketball + shower scene I’m not even joking, Harrington 100% felt what it is like to be a girl objectified in a nightclub

Billy calling Steve pretty boy is so fucked up like are you Eddie Munson? No so imma need you to back off ✋

Jfc no wonder Vecna chose max she’s a walking gold mine for therapists

One drive with Billy would be enough for me to become a target for Vecna I swear

A part of me will always blame Dustin for the cat’s death 🥲

Stranger things is so good I cannot fucking believe my eyes sometimes

First Nancy, now Hopper… can they like, stop going inside creepy ass portals all by themselves? FFS

OH MY GOD ERICA WAS SO SMALL HOW CUTE SINDFKJDF

Lucas telling Max “if I tell you the truth, you could be arrested or killed. Do you accept the risk?” Hits different now

FINALLY THE DUSTIN/STEVE DUO IS BORN

I was today years old when I realized Nancy broke up with Steve in S1 for a month but then she got back with him because she got tired of waiting for Jonathan

Dustin’s proud smile when Steve told him “good call dude” I CANT IM WEEK IM CRYING ON THE FLOOR

I will never get over Dustin’s pure adoration for Steve in this season

JUSTICE FOR BOB

BOB NEWBY THE SUPERHERO 😭😭😭

Everyone: it’s like the mind flyer! Steve&Max: don’t speak nerd in my presence pls

I’m sorry but Mike holding that small trophy as a weapon LOL

I CANNOT BELIEVE THE KIDS WERE AT THE WINDOW WHEN BILLY CAME ARE STUPID

I cannot believe they wanted to leave a beaten-up and concussed Steve behind, are you crazy???

I totally forgot that Steve, in a span of a couple of hours, pushed his girlfriend to be with another guy, got beaten up defending kids he barely knows and then went down - all beaten up and concussed - the upside down tunnels just for said kids?? ARE U EVEN REAL MAN?

Will turning to Mike when that girl asked him to dance 🥺

Nancy is so fucking right, those girls are so stupid turning Dustin down like fuck you who do you think you are????

Jopper at the end, I love my parents so much

Here my thoughts on S1!

#I know I took a long time #I wanted to savor it okay??#Steve season 2 is premium quality #I know I mostly talk about steve but like #have you seen my blog???#you should be surprised when I DONT talk about him #stranger things #stranger things rewatch #random st thoughts #season 2 rewatch #stranger things 2 rewatch

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erikiara80 · 1 year

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Will and Jonathan

To celebrate Will’s birthday, long post dedicated to my favorite brothers and their beautiful bond.

Season 1

The most terrifying week of Jonathan’s life. First, he thought that if he had been at home, nothing bad would’ve happened to Will. Then, if you think about it, he is the only one who thought for at least two days that Will really died. His worst nightmare. He failed to protect his little brother.

But he’s always there for Will. And if he had been there that night too, the Demogorgon would’ve killed him and taken Will anyway. And Will would’ve have been lost.

When Will is sad, Jonathan can always make him smile and feel better:

I have a brother, eight years younger than me. We are very close. I basically raised him. You know, single mom (divorced parents when I was 13 and my brother was 5), night shifts. And we were also poor.

I relate to the Byers so much. In my family, I am Jonathan. It’s so painful to imagine what he felt when Hopper told him that they had lost Will

When he saw Will’s small body on that table

Season 1 is a roller coaster of emotions. But they all love Will too much. And their love saved him. This is one of the most precious moments in the whole show, imo. I love it so much.

Jonathan is so emotional. He holds Will’s hand as if he wants to be sure that Will won’t go away again. Also, wonderful performance from Charlie. I can feel all Jonathan’s love, happiness and relief

Season 2

Another big season for the Byers brothers. And another time Jonathan risked to lose Will. The crazy thing is that this time Will is there but something is trying to erase everything he is. Another nightmare (army of monsters aside, lol)

Once again, the season starts with Jonathan taking care of his family (I really hope tho that at the end of the story, he can finally live his life and find his happiness, knowing that his family is safe. It’s so unfair -Lonnie’s fault- that he has all those responsibilties at such young age)

Fortunately, he also has Nancy. He’s starting to find something for himself. Problem is, Henry doesn’t care. So, the moment Jon leaves town... oops, Will gets possessed. No wonder he thinks he can’t leave him and his mom.

But before that, we get another beautiful moment where Jonathan encourauges Will to be himself and be proud of it (Jonathan is just a wonderful person, ok?)

Will is so upset about everything. He knows nobody can understand how he feels. At first he doesn’t even want to talk with Jonathan.

But Jonathan knows him so well and always knows what to say. Being a freak is actually the best. Normal people never accomplish anything important in this world.

And then this. So sweet. Aaaand we also have little shit Will, who always reminds his siblings that they are friendless, lol. I love him

And of course, Will smiles again

Then, sorry Jonathan. The real nightmare begins. I love S2, because there’s so much love for Will in every scene. From Mike, Joyce, Jonathan. What an amazing season! I’m so happy that S5 will include big S2 ideas but also have S1 vibe. The two seasons where Will and the love people have for him are central.

The last episodes are incredible. I just love everything.

The shed scene is absolutely one of my favorite scenes of the show, and imo, one of the best. Stellar acting, perfect shots, amazing dialogue, and oh, the emotions. It’s simply perfect. And different from what we usually see in Stranger Things.

They love him so much

But then this moment kills me every time. Jonathan is desperate. He can’t hear Will screaming and being in such pain without helping him. I’m glad Nancy was there. In fact, a few minutes later, he tries to help Will, but it was a mistake.

Jonathan couldn’t think anymore. He was sure Will was dying. He had to save him. But Nancy, as always, helped (yeah, she hurt Will, but it was the only way) This scene!

And then, he got his brother back

Season 3

There aren’t as many scenes as in the previous seasons, but the love between them is always there.

Always protective

And even when he doesn’t say anything, Jonathan always see his brother’s pain, like Charlie said.

Season 4

Both brothers are struggling a lot now. They’re older and for a while they probably thought they weren’t as close as they used to be. And that hurt and must have felt so strange. Jonathan is almost adult now. He feels all the weight of his responsibilities. He feels like living his life means abandoning his family. So he’s stuck. So glad he has Argyle!

And Will is dealing with feeling different, his feelings for Mike and the fear that he will never be happy. He’ll never find love. It doesn’t help that for the first time he doesn’t feel his brother’s support. Jonathan seems different and distant. Maybe Will, who’s more aware of his sexuality now, even believes that it’s his fault if his brother doesn’t spend much time with him anymore.

That’s heartbreaking.

But of course it’s not true, it will never be true. Jonathan never stops caring, or being protective. No matter what.

Oh, and this moment. This moment...

This is the season where both Will and Jonathan have much less scenes than in any other season, and yet S4 is where they share probably their most emotional and beautiful moment. This is the only scene in the show, along with when they find Will’s fake body in the quarry, that made me cry.

It’s so beautiful. Many people criticize it and say it wasn’t clear enough. That the writers were cowards. But I think it’s the opposite. It’s so delicate. And so in character. Jonathan was so sweet.

He didn’t push Will, because he didn’t know if Will was ready. He knows Will is afraid of losing the people he loves, that they won’t accept him. So he didn’t explicitly say that he knows. He just let his little brother know that he will always love him. That he will always be there. He made Will understand that he is important and special to him, and he will always be.

And NOTHING. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING will ever change that.

And Will’s little smile and tears when he hears those words. Jonathan hasn’t forgotten about him. He wasn’t distant because he knows and doesn’t approve.

He’s just dealing with his own problems. And I love, love that here Will also wants to reassure Jonathan that he will always be there for him too.

This has never happened in other seasons. It was always Jonathan the one who offered support. And it makes me hope that in S5, the season of Will’s coming of age, he too will reassure and protect Jonathan, and tell him that he deserves happiness.

Jonathan’s always been there for Will, and I’m sure he will do everything to protect him again in S5. But Will will protect his brother (and mom) too. Jonathan will see him become confident and find love with Mike. He’ll see his mom with Hopper, and El happy too. And he’ll finally know that he can live his life and that his family is safe and happy.

#will byers #jonathan byers #the byers brothers #jonwill #will's birthday #the byers #the byers family #brotherly love #stranger things

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thestrangestthing89 · 1 year

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When Robin assumes that Nancy is jealous of her relationship with Steve at the library she is wrong. She doesn't know Nancy and she makes an assumption based on very little information.

Here's a recap of what happened to Nancy that day: That morning she was working on the newspaper at school and everyone is watching the news. It's a report about Chrissy's death. The news goes on to list a number of other awful things that have happened around town recently. One of which was what happened to Barb. The news says Barb died because of a toxic chemical leak from the lab. That's the official story that the town was given and it's a story Nancy helped create the previous season with Murray and Jonathan so that Barbs parents could get closure. When Barb is mentioned on the news the audience sees a flash of her dying in the UD. That's the truth. Not what's on the news. But we see Nancy's face after Barb is mentioned. She's upset. And she knows what Chrissy's death could mean.

She asks Fred if he wants to come along with her and investigate. We haven't seen Fred before but I'm going to say they are friends. Not only do we see them working well together on the paper, but Fred knows some of the things going on with her and Jonathan. Nancy's talked about her personal life with him, at least a little bit. They go to the trailer park to look around and ask people questions. During this time, Fred ends up wandering off by himself and gets killed by the same thing that killed Chrissy. It's a gruesome death.

When Nancy realizes that Fred isn't in the trailer park she is upset and panicking. She asks one of the officers to help her. When we see Nancy again, she is being questioned by the police where Fred's body was found. She is visibly upset and scared. She's being questioned just like she was questioned when Barb died. By the same officers, only she's alone this time instead of with her mother. Nancy is relieved to see the car pull up with Steve, Robin, Max, and Dustin. She thought she was alone and she has a theory about Victor Creel that the officers are dismissing in the same condescending tone they dismissed her with when she was worried about Barb.

When Nancy goes to the library, she wants to go alone. She doesn't want to say her theory because the officers made her believe it was silly and she's second guessing herself. It's the same thing that causes her to go off alone to look for Barb. She went back to Steve's place by herself because no one was listening to her and when she was there she came into close contact with the demogorgon. Like last time, she's sure enough about her instincts to still want to look even though people are doubting her. Steve insists that he should come with her because it's dangerous to be by herself when bad things are happening. Nancy keeps telling him she's fine. When Robin insists on going with her instead, Nancy isn't mad or annoyed with her. She's a little amused and shrugs her shoulders at Steve. But she wanted to go by herself.

The last time she took a friend to investigate something with her he died. And the last time she had a friend go with her to a party that that friend didn't want to go to, she died.

Nancy wants to do things by herself. She's been reminded of Barb several times that day and her new friend just died. But there is Robin inserting herself into what Nancy is doing. I do think that part of Nancy's annoyance toward her had to do with her rambling. Nancy had a long, awful day and I think she just needed a minute to herself.

But Robin doesn't know all of this stuff about Barb and she doesn't know Nancy's relationship to Fred. Because she doesn't know Nancy. So she assumes that Nancy is stand-offish with her because she's jealous of her relationship with Steve. And the audience assumes she is right because they don't understand that girls can be upset for reasons that have nothing to do with a boy or jealousy.

Nancy's behavior toward Robin doesn't change immediately after Robin clarifies the platonic nature of her relationship with Steve. She's still annoyed with her when they are going through the tabloid that Robin suggested they look at. She only starts taking Robin seriously when it turns out that she's right. She realizes Robin makes a good teammate and pairs herself off with her again later when they go into Pennhurst. It's worth noting here that she excludes Steve from this field trip. I think this was not only because someone did need to stay with Max, but because Steve and Nancy have never been a good team. He dismisses her a lot (especially in S2 with her feelings about Barb) and it's part of the reason she was hesitant to tell him her theory about Victor before she went to the library. But Robin didn't dismiss her. She listened to her hunch and offered helpful suggestions. So Robin gets picked to go with her. Nancy knows she can trust her now.

However, Robin continues to make the wrong assumptions about how Nancy and Steve should be together. She doesn't know Nancy and she is biased by her friendship with Steve. She doesn't ask Nancy how she actually feels (I wrote more on this here). The audience is supposed to question her judgement. She isn't basing this idea that they'd make a great couple on anything concrete. She just wants her friends to be happy and believes simply pairing them off is the solution. She's not thinking about if they are actually compatible. They are TELLING us that Nancy and Steve should be together, but they are SHOWING us the opposite all season (and the whole series really).

But when Robin suggests that her and Nancy are friends, we can see how happy this makes Nancy. She doesn't really have friends. Her friends keep dying. She mentions in season 2 that she is going to have a sleepover at a girls house but she's lying about it. She is not close with these girls. We never see them together. They were an excuse to give her mother so she could go off with Jonathan. She clearly wants to be close with Robin, but she's hesitant at the library because she doesn't want another bad thing to happen to someone close to her. But Robin proves she can keep up with Nancy, so Nancy starts to let her in. That interaction at the library - not about Steve. Nothing Nancy did this season was about Steve. Everything Nancy did this season was about Barb. Henry shows her images of Barb dying later in the season and it's part of what motivates her to come up with the plan to kill him. She still feels responsible for her death and Henry is able to use this to manipulate her. Nancy has not shown any interest in Steve beyond superficially finding him attractive. The audience is meant to question the randomness of Robin's comments. They are supposed to feel like they came out of nowhere because Robin is wrong.

#anti stancy #nancy wheeler #robin buckley #steve harrington #jancy

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that-bitttch · 2 years

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Reasons I dislike Nancy Wheeler:

1) She just feels super two dimensional to me ngl. Even without taking a look at her character arc and actions, she kinda just.. exists for me

2) her whole personality can basically be summarised as: Independent woman who likes boys and guns. Yes I can and will look further into that if wanted in another post.

3) She is so condescending? Like all the time! Her opinion is the only valid one apparantly and everyone else is below her. Examples of this include: her treatment of Robin, her treatment of the kids, her treatment of Fred and many more.

4) She insults literally everyone. S1 begins with her insulting Steve's intelligence (which i have a lot of issues regarding not just for Nancy but all of the shows characters and I will follow up on this). S4 she insults Fred, a literal child following her guidance, for having differing opinions, IN THE 80S!! as people like to say when defending the shows harsher aspects.

5) her character literally never develops. S1 she began investigating Barbs death and never stopped. Held her feminist ideals *THAT I AM NOT AGAINST FTR*. Got given a gun and boys. And that was it for her. Every single season for her goes the exact same: Something bad happens, Nancy investigates, people doubt her and laugh, gets given a speech to carry on, is proven right, shoots the bad guy.

6) Does not seem to overly care about anyone else? S1 she did not GAF about anything going on unless it affected her. Will went missing? gosh Mike stop acting childish. Barb goes missing? Why is the world so unfair! Nobody is listening to me!

7) Like, she was only really investigating for her own career? In s3 and 4 in the least. She may have posed it to everyone else that she cared about the odd events, but she just wanted to be the first to get the good story. Like talking to Wayne Munson in the beginning and trying to invoke sympathy for her plight. It was just.. Not It for me.

8) she is selfish. Like i get she is a teenager, and teenagers are selfish, but... I would not like her irl unlike the other characters. Not one bit. She is always in everything for herself and she refuses to out herself in other peoples shoes for even a second. Mike is distraught over Will? Lets go have sex with Steve and argue with Mike. Steve wants to pretend a literal TRAUMATISING event didnt happen because he is also, a literal child? Nah he is bullshit. Jonathan decided not to fly down from California, despite literally being poor and having siblings to look after whilst pulling away from a ldr? Nothing she did there was wrong obvs.

9) the way she treats her partners is so horrible. Lets recap. S1- is dating Steve. Okay, so she lies to him about what she is doing with someone who TOOK PICTURES of HIS house without consent. Does not include him, her boyfriend, in her thoughts, and leaves him with the impression she is cheating on him. S2- still dating Steve. Lied to him for a whole year about her thoughts on their relationship. Gets drunk and calls him and their relationship bullshit while implying he is a murderer for something that is not his fault. Acts like it is not her fault when confronting him the next day. Proceeds to fuck off with Jonathan and have sex with him before even ending the relationship properly, and that is after insisting that there will never be anything between the two of you. S3 she just absolutely does not listen to a word Jonathan says and does what she wants whilst expecting him to drop everything for her and follow her around. S4 she puts the blame of their failing relationship on Jonathan and flirts with Steve.

10) she is really entitled. She is like the definition of a spoiled. She is handed things that she wants on a silver platter and is applauded when she gets it? Like she comes from what looks to be a upper lower/ middle class family in a nice meighbourhood with two parents, wanting for nothing, and does not seem to understand when people do not have the same constraints as her. Like she is okay to drop her job at the change of a hat but others actually need the money to survive? It is canon that Jonathan worked A LOT to help pay bills, and babysat Will, and she just, did not understand.

11) she gets applauded for doing the bare minimum. She showed up to help Eddie purely for the inside scoop and because she would look bad otherwise, and is HCed to be his new bestie? She tells Jason to fuck off? Shoots Vecna AFTER it has been set on fire? Like Hopper BEHEADS a whole ass demogorgon after being tortured and starved in Russia, but gets so little recognition.

12) literally risks getting her friends and family locked up/killed by the US government, for her guilt over killing Barb, and the want of a good story to publish. Like they were willing to shoot a shit ton of people for a child abusing lab who had no ides there was a child abusing lab *cough cough Benny*, and shoot a bunch of 11 year olds. They would have had no qualms about getting rid of them all!

13) literally abandons Mike, her BROTHER to go with her fresh BF at the end of s2! She was definitely not needed there, in fact she would have been more useful at the house with Steve and the kids, but nope.

14) Doesnt have a good relationship with her mother for what? Her caring? Like Karen Wheeler has her faults (Billy. Thats enough said) but noone can say she does not care about her kids. And Nancy just takes that for granted. This one is a personal slight, because a parent that offers up good advice, support and genuinely cares? That would be the life!

I am going to stop myself here, because I could probably go on for hours ranting. If you want to discuss any of this with me feel free to drop mw a message or something! No hate though please! I respect everyones opinions and will gladly take part in RESPECTFUL debate about any of this!

#stranger things #stranger things 4 spoilers #nancy wheeler #anti nancy wheeler #anti nancy #anti stancy #anti jancy #anti ronance

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dinitride-art · 2 years

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Nancy and Mike (and Robin) - Character Relationship Analysis/Exploration

Nancy and Mike’s relationship has always been really interesting to me. We don’t see Nancy pull away from Mike but we see Mike reacting to Nancy’s absence in his life. He tells their parents about Steve, and takes Nancy’s things, and tries to hold onto their relationship in the only way he knows how to. Because Nancy acknowledges him when he’s annoying her and when she’s angry at him. Or when he’s in danger. That’s it.

Nancy doesn’t play D&D with him anymore. She doesn’t talk to him anymore. Even in season four, the most we see of their relationship is Nancy driving Mike to school. And even though Nancy’s been pushing Mike away, he still goes to her when Eddie tells him and Dustin to find a replacement for Lucas. Mike keeps trying to come into her life, and Nancy keeps pushing him out.

Nancy is constantly trying to find a place in the world. She’s with Steve in season one because she thinks that’s what she’s supposed to do. And she gets good grades and studies and goes to party’s in season two. Even to the detriment of her relationships. However, she doesn’t take any blame for her actions, because of the societal pressure for her and everyone else to conform. Jonathan confronts her about it when they’re trying to find Will and Barb and she’s immediately defensive. She gets back together with Steve and blames Jonathan for not making a move sooner. Barb tells Nancy that she’s making a mistake with Steve, and Nancy tells her to go home.

But Barb dies.

Nancy blames herself for that. She blames herself for a lot of things. But she doesn’t want to understand why she blames herself for these things. Jonathan’s already told her that living married to Steve and conforming to societal expectations is bullshit. And she knows it is. But admitting that she’s hurt people by conforming, and trying to get them to conform, means that she’s hurt more than just herself. She’s hurt Barb. And Jonathan. And she even hurt Steve.

But most of all, she doesn’t want to admit that she’s hurt, and has been hurting, Mike the whole time.

That’s why she doesn’t like Robin at first. Because Robin is very similar to Mike. She’s loud, and impulsive, and says the wrong thing at the wrong time. And she can’t help it in the slightest. It’s not Robin’s fault that Nancys cold to her at first. It’s got nothing to do with Robin. Nancy just doesn’t want to admit that Mike hasn’t done anything wrong either. Because that means she’s wrong. And that means that she’s hurt him.

Mike and Robin both display autistic traits. Honestly, a lot of the characters in Stranger Things do, but these two are the ones with the most on screen brushback against those traits. Everyone has autistic traits, and having autistic traits doesn’t necessarily mean that someone’s autistic but. Considering that this is a writing choice, I think it’s fair to assume, at the very least, that they’re autistic-coded. And the reactions we are told and that we see, like Robin telling Nancy that she doesn’t pick up on social queues easily, and that her mother thinks she’s got something wrong with her. Versus what we see with Mike, people calling him annoying and an asshole and oblivious. Going to Lucas for help with El because he doesn’t understand what he’s supposed to do.

The key difference between Mike and Robin is what we see and what we’re told. Robin always tells us what she’s thinking and feeling and who she is. But with Mike we’re shown what’s happening. Same with them being queer characters, we’re told that Robin likes girls, and we’re shown that Mike likes Will. Robin is a queer character for a heteronormative audience. Mike is a queer character, regardless of the audience’s biases. Robin tells us that she doesn’t pick up on social queues. She explains that to Nancy, and Nancy is confronted with what we’ve seen the entire time with Mike.

Mike doesn’t pick up on social queues either. And Nancy knows this, and she’s seen all of his similarities to Robin as a bad thing. And she’s told him that he’s doing something wrong for being that way.

The reason that Nancy doesn’t like Mike, why she pushes him away, and calls him annoying and an asshole, is because Mike can’t be like her.

He can’t conform in the same way that Nancy does. And she doesn’t understand why he can’t.

Until she meets Robin.

And there’s a neon sign in front of her face that says, “Mike didn’t deserve this. It wasn’t his fault. He’s different, and so is Robin, and you told him that something was wrong with him.”

Nancy hurt him. She pushed him away. Told him in every way possible that his interests, and friends, and personality were wrong. And that she didn’t want a brother who was like that.

And now she knows why. Robin told her why.

Nancy doesn’t hate Mike. She’s scared that she was wrong. That Mike hasn’t really done anything wrong. That it was her fault that their relationship is like this.

And she’s scared.

Because she’s a lot more like Mike than she wants to admit.

#mike wheeler #Nancy wheeler #byler #my writing #in my personal experience of this #they’ll be fine after Mike turns 16 #and Nancy stops hating him for things he can’t change about himself #and stops hating herself for the same thing #they’ve just got to get there #and Nancy has to be the one to work for that relationship #because Mike doesn’t trust her anymore #anyways I’ve been thinking about why Nancy didn’t like Robin at first for a while #and I think it’s because she did like Robin at first #and Robin reminded her of Mike #and she had to admit that to herself #and I’ve also wanted to talk about Robin being the character that we’re told things for a while now #she’s the opposite of show don’t tell #and honestly how a lot of queer characters are presented in media #and she contrasts mike and Will so much #because we’re shown everything with them #I just think it’s neat !

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nxghtlxxght · 2 years

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It’s not that late this time

Honestly, if mike told El that he loved her, in a way that would suggest he was IN love with her ( there’s a difference ), it would seem unreasonably forced. Like I can’t for the life of me think of a scenario in which that would happen and it would seem natural.

The fact of the matter is that over the course of 3 seasons ( 2, 3, and 4 so far ), Mike hasn’t been able to tell El that he loved her, to her face at least. I personally would only partially count when he said he loved her to the others, because it’s not as authentic.

I’ve heard people say that s2 doesn’t count for the amount of time Mike’s had to tell El that he loved her, but I kind of disagree. Throughout season 2, Mike had a full 353 days to consult and figure out his feeling for El. I get why people say it doesn’t count though, he wasn’t near her for the relative entirety of the season.

Back to the point, I said this in another post here, but Mike maturing ( which he isn’t doing great at ) would be a shit excuse at trying to get m!lvn back on track. First, in my very humble opinion it would just be bad writing for Mike to suddenly tell El that he loves her. That in and of ITSELF is bad writing.

Second, Mike maturing into a healthy relationship isn’t healthy, aka Mike maturing into being in love with Eleven. If he wasn’t sure when he started dating her, then he should’ve waited. He’s essentially dragging El along and she doesn’t deserve that. Maybe instead of trying to fix an obviously broken relationship, he could work on his internalized homophobia and talk about something other than his relationship

Kind of beside the point, but both Mike and El have a mild co-dependency issue because neither of them have been in a healthy relationship ( as explained here as well ). Mike admitted it, he’s been too focused on El to figure out that he’s been completely ignoring Will and their relationship. He’s kind of obsessed with her, he immediately took an interest in her the moment they met and hasn’t been able to pull his attention away from her for enough time. He has no idea what real love is, he can’t even take an example from his parents. So he finds comfort in El and what they have.

El, like Mike, has no image of what a healthy relationship is either. She’s been stuck in a lab where she was abused and controlled for years, she didn’t have a real family until Hopper, Joyce, Will and Jonathan. Along with that, she has an unhealthy obsession with Mike. Sending letters, having a Mike themed box, being a perfectionist about meetings in s3, her anger when she couldn’t see him. ( + her up front rejection of Max due to jealousy )

Because of their shared co-dependency, they look for comfort and love in each other, which in the end only led to an unsteady relationship and both parties becoming upset in one way or another. They were better as friends, they had no unhealthy co dependency, they had meaningful conversations and a good time together, and all around they were happy.

Also beside the point, but if Mike wasn’t ready to commit to a relationship where he could be sure of his feelings, he shouldn’t have gotten in one. I get the concept of finding yourself through relationships, but that’s only okay if you have your partner’s consent. Everyone saw how hurt El was when she confronted Mike about not loving her, and I bet everyone was as equally pissed off at mike when he suggested only loving her because of her powers. Without letting El know that he wasn’t 100% positive about what they were doing, he’s dug a really deep hole for himself that’s going to be hard to climb out of. He also has really bad wording in his encounters with El.

He couldn’t even say that he loved El to WILL, his best friend. Once again proving my point Micheal.

He needs to get his feelings figured out before jumping into something he doesn’t understand.

Good night <3

#Byler #i will die on this hill #mike wheeler is gay #gay mike wheeler #stranger things #will byers #byler is endgame #i hope #gay #good night #10:23 pm #<3 #this one is longer than my other posts #kay rants

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dirtytransmasc · 2 years

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y'know what really gets me about billy antis? They're normally:

Karen stans

Steve stans

Jason Carver apologists

way to neutral about Neil

all of the above

Like, Karen drooled over and tried to fuck a teenager, a boy the same age as her daughter, and had her husband and daughter not been asleep by the door, she would have gone through with it. Plus she's kind of a shit mom like she has a few moments with her kids, but normally she only notices their not ok once they're way past their fucking breaking point. it is obvious her (and ted, he definitely holds some of the blame) shit parenting fucked her kids up

Steve, as much as I love him (I literally kin him as hard as I kin billy, but I still acknowledge his past), was a fucking dick in season one and even part of season two, and he lived a pretty similar life as billy. But he gets a redemption arc and all of the fandoms fawning because he's a palatable, 'simple' abuse victim (I hate having to say that cause that doesn't exist in actuality, only in the minds of assholes who don't actually give a shit about mental health). But because billy was more reactive than steve, which is warranted given his whole situation and the way his abuse presented itself, and didn't live long enough to even start trying to become a better person, he deserves to die painfully, right? Make it make sense cause steve checks all the boxes billy did; bigotted (homophobic and classist towards Jonathan, sexist towards nancy after they break up, I'm putting good money on him being racist in high school because he's rich and white, and its the fucking 80s), classic highschool douche bag. the double standard is gross.

Do I need to explain why the whole Jason apologist thing is bad cause they love to attack billy stans for being racist but defend the kid who was only friends with Lucas cause he was 'one of the good ones' only to try and shoot and beat the shit out of him once he was no longer 'one of the good ones. like he held him at gunpoint and made him beg for mercy... totally wasn't racially motivated. And the way he had his goons tackle erica, an 11-year-old girl. He also got him shit-faced (Lucas was a freshman, Jason is a senior, and I don't know much about how party code is around other places and what it was like back then, but major red flag in my book). Not to mention leading a literal manhunt for an unconfirmed suspect and being prepared to hurt and/or kill anyone who got in his way, no matter who or what age they were. Like y'all will defend him, the picture-perfect white boy who did all that, but not the 17-year-old abuse victim who lashed out what? Twice in the literal 3 weeks of screentime he got? Jason did all that in a week's time, which is way worse than anything Billy did.

Wanting death for an abuse victim, acting out because they were abused, but not giving half a shit for their abuser is fucking weird. Like how can you do that? It's canon that Neil beat his last wife and billy, and by the way we see Susan act, probably hit her too. Like if your gonna hate billy, at least hate Neil too.

Like I could go on about the hypocrisy in the billy anti fandom, but these are the major things. I have so many words for billy antis tbh, but they don't have a long enough attention span for it to matter.

#billy hargrove #max mayfield #neil hargrove #susan hargrove #steve harrington #karen wheeler #jason carver #anti jason carver #anti neil hargrove #anti karen wheeler #stranger things #stranger things 4 #stranger things spoilers #dirtytransmasc

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eightfifteen · 1 year

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The reason i like to analyse character's music taste isn't because i care what it is that they listen to, but more how their music reflects their personality and experiences.

It's the eighties, which means that the only ways to be introduced to music are through the radio, by the people around you recommending stuff or by actively going to a library/music store to look for new things.

The radio

The party doesn't seem to care about music at all. Dustin has nothing of note hanging in his bedroom suggesting there's any band or whatever that he likes, and in season one they refer to Should I Stay Or Should I Go as 'that weird song'. This suggests that Dustin and Lucas and Mike even probably just listen to the radio or whatever music their parents play.

When Mike is with El in s3, they're just listening to the radio, and that's the music Mike's familiar with as he starts singing along. it's the only time in the whole show Mike shows any interest in music at all.

2. influence of the people around you

Will's influenced by Jonathan. He himself is not the kid that goes into music stores because he's a kid and prefers to spend his time with his friends. But Jonathan, on the other hand, doesn't have friends and probably does go to the music store to find new music similar to the ones he likes. More importantly, he has the time and interest to curate the songs he copies off the radio.

Will cares about Jonathan's opinion at first because it's a thing they have in common and because he doesn't really know what else to listen to anyway. And that influence clearly sticks with him because he has a positive association with these bands and this style.

Mike on the other hand, clearly doesn't care about his parents' opinions and would automatically reject their music, and he's also not going to listen to what Nancy listens to because they have that typical sibling relationship where everything your sibling does is automatically bad.

If there's one person that would influence Mike, it's Eddie in season 4. But still, we don't see him being into Metal music, and i think that's just not his style at all. I think Mike would nod and pretend to like it because he wants Eddie to like him, but it's not something he would genuinely enjoy.

3. Going out to explore music on your own

In season 4 in California, Will clearly went out to explore music of his own because we can see that he likes new bands like The Cure, and that he has a record player now.

Jonathan was distant, and he didn't have any friends anymore, so he was either influenced by his classmates/new environment and/or went out to music stores or libraries or whatever to find new music on his own. He also has a lot more time now, like Jonathan, to just sit in front of the radio and record songs he likes from Californian radio stations, meaning he's exposed to a whole new variety of music, and actually gets to chose the songs he likes of his own accord.

Still, the fact that he got a record player and the new poster suggests he at least had to go out to a record store, because you can't copy those off the radio.

It represents him growing older and into his own person, and also how being in a new environment is influencing him/shaping him, and yet how he tries to stick to something that binds him with Jonathan. But also music is in turn influenced by his inner feelings. How he looks for music to represent him and as a genuine hobby/distraction rather than just something to passively turn on for background noise.

We see the same with Max, where she suddenly has her walkman and a variety of tapes with her at all times. Music is a way to cope for her, and as the alternative is being in the trailer park alone, I'd see her go out to music stores to search for new songs plenty. It represents her looking for an escape and a distraction, where music is no longer just something to dance to but also something to grief with and to just get lost in. But her music choice (Kate Bush) in turn also reflects how she's feeling, because her feelings influence her taste.

#stranger things #analysis #music #st #will byers #the party #max mayfield

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kotomori · 1 year

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So I have a question. One that links back to the scene in Season 4 during the conversation between Nancy and Steve in the Upside down during the last episode and why I'm not really a fan of how the aftermath of it is handled in some fics I've read, but this is solely based off my own opinion.

For the sake of fanon over canon (canon doesn't exist. I dont know her) Let's say theres a scenario where all of the party are together, Eddie and Max are recovering and they're all at Steve's or something like that. But if we're gonna go down more of a canon route in S5 with Nancy, Jonathan and Steve, I honestly dont think either of them will end up together. (Mainly because I have a bad feeling at least two of these three arent gonna make it out alive) but back to fanon, let's say Jonathan and Nancy have broken up but they're still learning how to be around eachother as friends just like Steve and Nancy are doing. Again, I feel like this would've been a way better way to go for their character development if Stancy were spending their time together just learning how to be around eachother again. It would've made for a much better dynamic in season 5 between the three.

Anyhow, I'm getting sidetracked. Goes without saying that Steve is easily my favourite stranger things character. However I've always had some mixed feelings when it came to Nancy, noticing on more than one occasion that while she is genuinely a good person and a complete badass who knows how to get shit done, she seems to have some problems feeling empathy for others, especially if the situation doesnt apply to her, though you could argue that Mike has the same issue when it comes to El and Will, in which he tries to understand but when he knows he cant he instead becomes frustrated and more often than not takes it out on them. Nancy definitely has this issue with Steve in season 2. During the first part of season 2 and to an extent season 1, Steve tries to offer her a distraction to her problems with guilt rather than a solution. And to an extent I believe that was how Nancy came to view Steve during season 2. A distraction instead of a solution, eventually realising this distraction was no longer helping her and taking out her frustrations on the distraction before finding a solution by going with Jonathan to find Murray for answers and realising that Jonathan was the one she wanted.

However during season 3 they seem to have a hard time understanding eachother and on top of that the two barely interact with Steve at all. Yet in season 4 Steve and Nancy are left to reconnect while Jonathan is in California, not to mention the underlying subplot that her and Jonathan are realising that much like her and Steve, they each have very different ambitions.

Nancy is very career driven and wants to make a difference in the world. Jonathan just wants to take care of his family and stay close to them following everything that has happened and is unsure if what he really wants is to spend his life following Nancy rather than being by her side. Steve on the other hand has developed a somewhat paternal bond with the party following what is implied to have been a very fundamentally lonely life. It's for this reason that it makes sense he would he happy with a simple quiet life, travelling the world with a family of his own. I'm not sure if the Duffers did this on purpose to mislead us or whether they've just forgotten what each of these characters have been through in each season but when you put all that in perspective, none of these ambitions align in the slightest. If anyone thought that the whole winnebago talk would actually become a reality in season 5, maybe in an epilogue or something like that, then people seem to not realise that Nancy wanted anything but to end up like her parents and displays little interest in anything other than protecting those she has and focusing on her career. A simple life would not be satisfying for her.

Long story short, trying to put Stancy back together romantically would not work for either characters arc, at least in my opinion. If they were able to form a strong platonic friendship by the end of season 5 then that would be the most satisfying outcome to me.

On a slightly different note I started this with a question. I see it alot in fics where people tease Steve for expressing what he wants out of life, i.e, the whole six little nuggets conversation. Honestly I found that while scene really sweet and the characters in fics rarely bring this up as a way to be mean. But I've seen in some that Nancy actually brings up what Steve told her in the upside down as a way to tease him in front of their friends. Again, it's hardly ever written with any malicious intent other than to embarrass him but even so I really dont see that being something she would ever tell anyone, even their closest friends. While I stated previously that Nancy struggles with empathy, I fully believe that she sees that moment herself as Steve being truly genuine and heartfelt with her. Point being that as much as the idea may not appeal to her, she can see would not use something like that as an excuse to bring up in conversation as a way to tease him or embarrass him by stating out loud for everyone to hear that he once dreamed they would start a family. I dont believe that Steve would repeat it to anybody else either, even Robin. That is something personal to the two of them whether Steve really knows what he wants or not and it's clear that there are alot of unspoken things regarding the past between them that I can see bringing up some tension in season 5.

Though I can't deny that I've had some angsty ideas following these thoughts. Imagine another scene like the bullshit scene in s2, only its after she finds out that Jonathan lied to her about college and maybe she gets drunk again, possibly for the first time since season 2 and when Steve tries to comfort her (maybe he found her first or she seeks him out, idk) but she reflects back on how it felt reconnecting with him in 4 and the conversation they had and drunkenly makes a move on him and is left even more confused when he rejects her and throws back in his face everything he said to her. Maybe Robin or Eddie or Jonathan overhear and jump in to seperate them before it turns into a fight. Steve feels guilty while Nancy is just even more confused about her feelings for Steve and Jonathan. Maybe it ends with them finally talking things through, Steve confesses he has feelings for someone else (I wonder who) and with a clearer head they realise it makes more sense for them to just learn to get to know eachother as friends again.

Anyhow sorry for the ramble, that's all for now :)

#steve harrington #nancy wheeler #eddie munson #robin buckley #steve harrington headcannon #nancy wheeler headcanons #steddie #platonic stancy #platonic stobin #jonathan byers #stranger things #we need more platonic stancy honestly #let me know how you feel about this prompt

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spookyclooky · 2 years

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considering I will never shut up about this, and I see a lot of people ganging up on each other over this, I've decided I'm going to publicly share at least a few (if not all) of the slides from a powerpoint I made for my friends explaining why Stancy doesn't work and Steddie does

Keep in mind, this was not originally intended for general audiences but I've reached the end of my rope with this and I'm gonna show you some research I did (though I'm gonna exclude some of my slides cause they're introducing the characters for my friends who don't watch ST)

my first two slides, because some of this was jokes but I'm so actually fucking serious about this it's crazy

my summarization of both of their relationships (some of the Steddie one was jokes because they don't actually have a canon relationship obv)

and this is the summation of my analysis of both relationships (or what I think their relationship could be by analyzing the way they interact in Steve and Eddie's case). This doesn't even include the fact that Steve evidently wants a big family according to ST4, which Nancy straight up said is the last thing she wants. So, in being with Steve, she'd be trapped in her worst nightmare and would grow to eventually resent him. She even says this during that conversation:

Because she doesn't want kids! She expressed this early on the series when she's talking about her parents with Jonathan, telling him about how her dad was older and her mom married him for money. She didn't want to be like her parents, she still doesn't. She's trying her hardest to pave a path for herself in her journalism, by any means necessary. You think she can do that stuck in a house on the end of a cul-de-sac with someone she never truly loved in the first place?? NO!!! She says this to Jonathan in S1 E6, which just further proves my point

so hearing that, do you think she wants a cute little family with Steve, schlepping across the country with "six little nuggets" in tow? Absolutely the fuck not.

AND, for Steve, he straight up tells Robin that he doesn't love Nancy anymore. While he was on 'truth serum' from the russians. He doesn't even hesitate, and here's the scene if you wanna watch it again cause you don't believe me.

Even Murray, an outsider looking in, could see their relationship was not it

Like, do y'all not remember this?

Cause I do

this shows that even an outside party, who is JUST MEETING Nancy, can tell that she no longer loves Steve, and that's assuming she ever had feelings like that for him in the first place.

In S4, he SPECIFICALLY says, after the bit about crawling backwards, that he says when he gets a big enough thump on his head, he can change and move forward. He thanks her for helping him to 'crawl forward', which I kind of interpreted as a 'hey, thanks for showing me that the way I was acting before sucked, and you breaking up with me changed my life for the better', the breakup acting as his proverbial bump to the head in this particular case.

Speaking as someone who has been in an extremely unhealthy relationship in the past, I think that Steve is simply going through a denial stage at this point, his rose colored glasses coming back on to romanticize the good parts of his and Nancy's relationship instead of seeing the entirety of it. The good and the bad, even though from what we see as an audience, there's much more bad outweighing the good. Especially considering they weren't together for very long by the time the events of season 1 took place.

At the beginning of season 2, it seems like from Steve's perspective, the stuff involving the Upside Down (i.e, Barb's death, facing the demogorgon together, etc.), brought them closer together, but to Nancy, it made it easier for her to distance herself from Steve, for whatever reasons she personally may have found prominent at the time.

She at least acts like she's in denial at first about not being in love with Steve, but she lets that fall apart insanely quickly, considering she kisses/sleeps with Jonathan at Murray's a few hours after they talk about her love life/relationship with Steve where she says that she does in fact love him??

Delving into the mind of Nancy Wheeler is a complicated endeavor, the same could be said for Steve Harrington himself, but long story short, the idea that the Duffers could possibly be pushing them back together bothers me a lot because it'd be like Steve crawling backward all over again. It's like they don't know what to do with him unless he has some sort of love interest and it kind of shows. In S1 and S2, it was Nancy, in S3, it was Robin and now they're trying to come full circle which doesn't make any logical sense.

In all honesty, I think Nancy should just take a break from having a relationship all together, to finally let herself grieve Barb properly and Steve should have a partner that matches his emotional maturity that he's gained over the past seasons.

But that's all I'm gonna say, so thank you for coming to my TED talk and I hope you enjoyed <3

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leslie057 · 2 years

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The Many Character Tropes of Jonathan Byers, according to TV Tropes

An Axe to Grind: Grabs an axe in the second act of Season 3 to help defend Hopper's cabin against the Mindflayer.

Badass Bookworm: A photographer, amateur journalist, and member of the Yearbook Club, he's also as courageous as they come and doesn't let anything come between him and his loved ones.

Badass Driver: In Season 3, when he and the party are driving away from the avatar of the Mindflayer.

Badass Normal: He's not an athletic jock like Steve or Billy, a cop like Hopper, or a psychic like Eleven, yet Jonathan probably takes more damage in fights than anyone not named Steve and absolutely none of it keeps him down.

Beware the Nice Ones: Whatever you do, don't taunt, nor make fun about, Will. Steve's bloodied, bruised face is Jonathan's response to it.

Beware the Quiet Ones: Jonathan is quite possibly the sweetest and least egotistical guy on the whole show, but when you manage to piss him off, watch out.

It takes two full-grown police officers to drag him away from Steve after the latter mocked Will's apparent death, and apparently broke Callahan's nose with a casual backwards elbow in the process.

Even after a brutal fight with his possessed boss Tom, Jonathan does not stay down and finally stabs Tom in the fucking throat with a pair of scissors.

Be Yourself: He told Will that he shouldn't do what society does just to make their father like him.

Big Brother Instinct: Protects Will from bullies, comforts him during his parents' arguments, and turns him on to punk and new wave music. And, goes ballistic if people try bad-mouthing his brother when he's not in sight. Isn't that right, Steve?

In the second season finale, he has to turn away and hold Nancy just so he wouldn't give in as the monster infecting Will screams for him to be let go when Joyce turn up the temperature. He ends up not being able to hold out as he unties one of his hands.

In Season 3, when Nancy realizes that Will might not be safe, that's all the incentive Jonathan needs to go look for him and realize something is horribly wrong.

Similarly, Season 4 has him openly declare that Eleven is his stepsister, and he goes absolutely mental when she's arrested.

After Jonathan realizes that Will is in love with Mike and struggling with his sexuality and unrequited feelings, he apologizes for being distant, tells Will that he can always talk to him, and lets Will know that he will always love him and nothing can ever change that.

Blue Collar Hero: An aspiring photographer and journalist who's good with cars and setting up booby traps for monster hunting. He even calls attention to this in Season 3, when in a rare spat of anger towards someone he loves, he points out that Nancy comes from a middle-class family and has enough connections to find a good job, while Jonathan is a social outcast from a Friendless Background, so the newspaper job is all he has.

Brooding Boy, Gentle Girl: The "brooding boy" to Nancy's "gentle girl.”

Camera Fiend: Has an interest in photography, which he uses to make missing person posters for Will. According to "Stranger Things Worlds Turned Upside Down: The Official Behind-The-Scenes Companion", he is a member of the Photography Club, the School Newspaper, and the Yearbook Club.

Chekhov's Gun: The nail-spiked bat Jonathan prepares to fight the Demogorgon turns out to be the only true deterrent they have against the monster... when Steve picks it up and takes some well-placed swings at it.

Commitment Issues: Jonathan has this in spades since he fears ending up like his abusive father and is trying to "break the cycle." It's so blatantly obvious that Murray calls him out on it after only knowing him and Nancy for a few hours. It causes a lot of awkwardness in his relationship with Nancy, especially in Season 4 when their Long-Distance Relationship lets him stew on it on his own for too long.

The Confidant: He tries to be this to Will, although he sometimes gets preoccupied by his own issues. In Season 4, he acknowledges that he and Will don't talk as much as they used to and apologizes for not being there for him while Will has been struggling with his sexuality and unrequited feelings for Mike.

Cool Big Bro: To Will. Jonathan looks after his brother and gives him good advice, like how it's important to stay true to yourself instead of acting a certain way because someone thinks you should. There are more than a few other hints that he's shielded and deflected Will not just from the abuse of bullies, but from their own father many times before.

Curb-Stomp Battle: An almost literal example in Season 1, when he knocks Steve down and spends the next five minutes punching him in the face as hard as possible. It takes two fully-grown cops to drag him away from Steve.

Determinator: He'll stop at nothing to look after and protect his family. Even after getting tossed around more than once by the creatures of the Upside Down, he always gets right back up again to keep up the fight.

Dogged Nice Guy: A fairly uncritical example towards Nancy, including taking secret pictures of her at a party, and they eventually get together.

Expository Hairstyle Change: More subtle than Nancy, but still present. In season 1, his hair is on the longer side with shaggy bangs that fall in his eyes, representing his loner personality, but after he's gained some confidence and a friend in Nancy, it's pushed back off his face more in season 2. In season 3 it's cut shorter and neater, to help fit in at the professional environment of the Hawkins Post, while season 4 has it longer and shaggier than ever to reflect his evolution into an aimless, burned-out stoner.

Fire-Forged Friends: With Steve and Nancy following the fight with the Demogorgon.

Friendless Background: Unlike his little brother, he doesn't seem to have any friends. Till the end of the series, after which him, Nancy, and Steve become Fire-Forged Friends.

At the start of Season 2, he's back to avoiding hanging out with the two. Mostly implied to be to give them space due to his and Nancy's UST. However, when she chooses him over Steve, they hang out together all the time...and then we don't see any of Nancy or Steve's other friends, while Steve becomes friends with Robin and stops hanging out with Nancy, or so it seems.

Subverted by Season 4, where he makes a best friend in California (Argyle), and now El, and possibly Will, are the ones without friends in California.

Genre Savvy: Eventually. Once he gets it, he goes all in on the whole "I'm in a creature feature" thing.

Good People Have Good Sex: He and Nancy have an active sex life.

Green-Eyed Monster: He seems jealous of Steve and Nancy's relationship, due to having a crush on Nancy. By the end of the season, however, Steve's change in attitude and their mutual fight against the Demogorgon has turned them into friends.

Guys Smash, Girls Shoot: Nancy and he bring a bat and a revolver respectively to kill the monster. Initially, they try practicing with the weapons they picked, but trade when Nancy proves to be the better shot.

It's All My Fault: He's terribly remorseful for not being at home when Will was being chased by the monster. Though what he could have done to prevent Will's abduction is debatable.

Jump Scare: Supplies one in the second act as we get an abrupt and loud Smash Cut to him trying to improve his aim with a revolver.

Like Parent, Like Child: Like Joyce, Jonathan is a quiet person who doesn't get along with most other people, but his bond with his family is stronger than steel, and he quietly sacrifices his own comforts to provide for them, especially Will. He can take a lot of abuse hurled his way, but, just like his mother, the moment you threaten or insult his family, you will regret and deserve the ferocity that he unleashes on you.

Loners Are Freaks: What most of the other high school kids think of him, given that he apparently has no (or very few) friends. He occasionally doesn't help his case.

Loser Son of Loser Dad: Steve calls him this almost verbatim before their fight in Season 1.

Love Cannot Overcome: After his family moves out of town at the end of Season 3, he and Nancy try a long-distance relationship. However, Season 4 quickly shows that the time apart and their lives seeming to head in very different directions has caused a lot of strain, leading to Jonathan - as Argyle puts it - to be "slow motion" breaking up with Nancy.

Made of Iron: During the hospital fight, Jonathan is strangled, thrown into several walls, hit with a metal stool, and slammed into the ground. He still manages to get up in time to stab his possessed boss to death with scissors.

Meatgrinder Surgery: In Season 3, when he has to improvise a not-medically-compliant surgical setup to cut a piece of the Mindflayer out of El's leg. While she's still conscious. Yuck.

Nice Guy: He's very kind and loving to his family (aside from his POS father) and to Nancy. He's rarely outwardly rude or antagonistic, unless you threaten or make fun of Will. Steve learned that the hard way towards the end of Season 1.

No-Holds-Barred Beatdown: Gives one to Steve after the latter taunts him about Will's death. It takes three people to pull him away.

No Social Skills: He's rather shy and socially awkward, and clearly prefers interacting with the world through a camera lens rather than in person. This contributes to the perception people have of him as a bit of a creep.

Parent with New Paramour: Downplayed. In Season 2, he has some hostility towards Joyce's new boyfriend, Bob — he freezes out Bob's attempts to befriend the boys and complains that he doesn't understand what his mother sees in him. However, he never really seems to dislike Bob, he just finds him a bit of a clueless dork. He turns out to be wrong about Bob.

The Peeping Tom: Played with. Steve and his friends think that he's just simply a pervert, though Jonathan says that this is not the case. He argues to Nancy that he takes pictures of people while hiding because he wants to assess their demeanor during open conversation. Jonathan's fight with Nancy at the woods confirms this notion, as he pretty much nails down Nancy with remarkable accuracy, to which she has no retort. However, Jonathan turns out to be wrong about his assessment of Steve as a petty jock (though in this case a certain amount of jealousy and resentment can be assumed to be colouring his perceptions). And he admits he should not have taken the pictures of Nancy in her bra, that was the hormones talking, and it was wrong.

Promotion to Parent: Thanks to Joyce being overworked, and Lonnie being a terrible person, he's pretty much taken up the 'Dad' role for Will.

A Real Man Is a Killer: His dad forcing this trope on him using those hunting expeditions when he was younger pretty much convinced him to step in to prevent Lonnie doing similar macho-making things to Will.

"The Reason You Suck" Speech: He and Nancy deliver these to each other. See Nancy's folder for details.

Relationship Upgrade: With Nancy, midway through Season 2.

The Reliable One: Jonathan is a bottomless well of competence amidst a cast of (understandably) emotionally damaged people. Need someone to comfort a frightened sibling? Keep the kids out of trouble? Drive the party where they need to go and fix the car once it breaks? Remove a piece of the monster from somebody's leg without proper surgical equipment? Jonathan's your man. One can make a strong argument that in three whole seasons of television, Jonathan has not made a single really bad decision.

Revolvers Are for Amateurs: In Season 1, he arms himself with a revolver when he starts planning to go after the Demogorgon.

Sensitive Guy and Manly Man: Especially in Season 1, he's the serious and responsible Sensitive Guy to Steve's Jerk Jock Manly Man.

Stalker with a Crush: He accidentally ends up spying on Nancy's and Steve's party, and not-so-accidentally ends up taking creepy pictures of her. This trope is invoked by Steve, Tommy, and Carol after they find out about the photos.

The Stoner: In Season 4 he has become this. Despite a few comedic scenes together with the resident pothead, new character Argyle, this trait is not actually Played for Laughs and instead shows how Jonathan is slowly losing control of his life, and how everything that happened is starting to take a toll on him.

Two Guys and a Girl: With Steve and Nancy, though it's debatable whether any of them fit the 'leader' role between the two guys.

Vomit Discretion Shot: His reaction after, unlike Joyce, actually believing and horrifed that the body that was uncovered was indeed Will's.

The Unfavorite: Downplayed given the circumstances, but during Joyce's obsession over finding Will in Season 1, Jonathan states that it's like she forgot that she still has a son that is alive.

Unresolved Sexual Tension: With Nancy at the end of Season 1; she gets back together with Steve but the tension between her and Jonathan is obvious. They get a Relationship Upgrade in Season 2.

Wise Beyond Their Years: Due to his mother's Sanity Slippage and the fact that his dad is a prime douche, he has to step up to take care of a lot of things. Like his little brother's funeral. He also has to deal with the worry that his mother is going through another anxiety episode on top of everything else, yet still keeps it together enough to work out that she's not wrong when Nancy hands him the proof.

#*post #jonathan byers #character analysis #character tropes #tv tropes #charlie heaton #stranger things #stranger things 4 #netflix #character study #these are so interesting #i love whoever wrote these #tw: mention of vomit #tw: mentions of murder

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bombshellsandbluebells · 2 years

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So I’ve seen people saying that Steve’s dream of having 6 kids / a big family in s4 feels out of character or is character assassination, but I honestly feel like that detail is INCREDIBLY in character for him.

The thing with Steve is that for as fun as he, and as much charm as Joe adds to the role, the writing has never been all that concerned with exploring him much more beyond “asshole in high school, now reformed” / “part of a love triangle.”

But by not exploring certain things about Steve, they’ve basically crafted a story for him anyways. There’s a reason why the “Steve’s an only child with emotionally distant if not downright neglectful parents” headcanon is so strong in the fandom - because all the apparent proof for it is right there, just by the omission of his parents from the writing at all.

He’s is the only one of the OG kids/teens that we’ve never seen the parents of. He’s been majorly injured every single season, usually a lot more than any of the others, and yet we’re never shown or told about his parent’s reaction to that. Steve’s parents are never really mentioned beyond s1, in which the only things we learn about them are that they have such bad relationship problems that his mom feels the need to accompany his dad on trips and that his dad is, in Steve’s words, a major asshole. That’s basically it for the Harringtons. (We also get one quick line about Steve putting his mom as a reference in s3 because she’s “super well respected” in the community, but that doesn’t necessarily prove that Steve has a good relationship with his mom. It could! But it doesn’t contradict the idea that he doesn’t.)

We can conclude that, because Steve never interacts with or mentions his parents, he’s not close with them. And we can go further and assume that because his parents never seem to take notice of his many injuries, they don’t pay a lot of attention to their son. This feels especially true when compared to the way the other parents factor into the show - even the ones that aren’t as important to the story as Karen Wheeler at least have a sort of presence.

Now, I tend to lean towards “accidental character development” over intentional writing choice, but the fact of the matter is that this conclusion CAN be drawn from the text and there’s nothing really there to disprove it.

One big thing that IS intentionally written with Steve is his big brother relationship with the kids. He looks out for them. He stands up for them. He has a deeper relationship with them than either of the other og teens do and gets grouped into storylines with them while Nancy/Jonathan get separated to do their own thing. We get little details like him sneaking them into movies and getting a letter from Max. (Which makes the lack of follow through with his relationship with Max or even Dustin in vol 2 so disappointing to me)

And it’s really, really easy to draw some connections and theorize that the reason Steve latches onto the kids so easily and lets them become such a big presence in his life is BECAUSE he has a distant family.

So Steve sitting there talking about how his dream for the future is having a big family and a bunch of kiddos and driving around with them together to see the country, spending quality time with them DOES make sense. It fits in perfectly with the story they crafted for Steve. He’s an only kid with emotionally distant parents who wants a family, who likes kids, who falls naturally into a big brother / guardian role and dreams about being a father one day.

It makes perfect sense with him.

The only problem with it is that it’s framed as something he wants with Nancy because a) the idea of Nancy sharing that dream feels incredibly forced for her character and not well supported by what we’ve seen of her so far (career-driven, focused on making a name for herself in journalism, not all that concerned with spending time with the kids, barely has a close relationship with her own brother), and b) putting Stancy back together again and leading them to a pickett fence marriage and kids ending feels incredibly forced after spending so much time in the show having them grow apart and having Steve get over her.

So no, I don’t hate the Steve wants 6 kids idea. I don’t even think it feels out of character. I just don’t think it works as a way to further Stancy.

#steve harrington #stranger things meta #stranger things #stranger things spoilers #st4 spoilers

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newgrangespirals · 1 year

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At this point it just feels as if the Duffers are punishing Steve for being a fan favorite when they did not want him to be. He is the cool, good-looking jock. I always got the impression that Jonathan was a stand in for the writers. He does some really shady things that no one ever brings up again, but people constantly bring up Steve being an asshole, when, on screen, we really only see him acting reactionary toward what he perceives to the be the truth. In season one, a girl goes missing from his backyard and a kid goes missing at the same time. Then he learns that a guy (already known for intentionally isolating himself) was in the woods behind his house the night the girl goes missing taking photos of his girlfriend changing. Then he learns that that same guy’s brother is the kid that went missing. I know what I would think in that situation. Steve does not know anything supernatural is going on. Then that same guy starts hanging around the girlfriend that he was stalking the same night her best friend disappeared. I would think he might have had something to do with it as well, regardless of the assumed cheating. Which is probably a trigger for him if Tommy’s comment about his parents meant anything.

However, Steve realizes he took it too far and apologized and made it right. That should have been the end of it. And moving into season 2 it was. Steve was partnered with Dustin and the Lucas and Max and was really cool and decent about the whole Nancy and Jonathan (even though this time she was cheating on him), however, putting Steve and Dustin together made the character too popular. The jock with a heart of gold and that was protective of the kids was never supposed to be a fan favorite. Jonathan was the artistic loner type, he was supposed to be the one everyone loves the most. Steve was supposed to get his comeuppance and have everyone cheer at the jock getting knocked down by a bigger jock. But that is not how it went.

Moving into season three, they are just straight up punishing the character. Everyone trets him like an idiot, even when he brings up legitimate points, and is the one to identify the music. Starting with Robin and her “Mr. Cool” speech. I love her and the scene in the bathroom is one of the most beautiful and well done of the show. But when they are tied up on the floor (after Steve has just been tortured) is not the time to tell this guy that he was a piece of shit for not noticing you. Robin was the year below Steve, why would he know her? Also, her sophomore year would have been 1983, he had other things going on. The only reason she didn’t like him is that her crush had a crush on him (something that was not Steve’s fault).

Every character on the show is consistently telling Steve that he is stupid, he can’t win fights (something absolutely untrue), and that he still needs to make up for being kinda a dick when he weas 17. He hasn’t been that way for years, and these are supposed to be his friends. Everyone has been just as much an asshole as we see Steve being in season 1 at some point. Mike and Dustin abandon their friend and don’t go to a very important game for him because he dared to have interests that they thought were stupid, all on the whim of a guy they have known for less than a year. Eddie himself won’t change the day. It would be easy to. Lucas doesn’t have control over the game schedule, but Eddie can change Hellfire. Asshole move. Nancy never recognized her part in the breakup with Steve. He was trying and she was not communicating her needs effectively, and then she told him, in the most brutal way possible, that she had been faking their year long relationship. She could have al least acknowledged that she hurt him and then cheated on him. Again Jonathan took naked pictures from the woods of Nancy without her knowledge, and then developed them in the school darkroom.

I am not saying Steve never messed up and did something wrong. He did. But he was never as bad as both the show and parts of the fandom want to make you believe. He is also the only one who has apologized for his behavior and then changed for the better afterward. Yet everyone in his life won’t let him grow with the change. They are still telling him he is that same asshole, stupid, jock. They keep punishing him for behavior he has grown past for years. Season 4 Steve is still paying for the things season 1 Steve did, where as, all the other characters are allowed to move past their mistakes with out everyone bringing them up every five minutes. Steve is the only character not allowed his deserved redemption arc, even though we watched it happen on screen.

It just kinds bothers me. What is the point of apologies and true regret and sincere growth, if everyone is still going to bring up things you did as a teenager. That really sucks if that is the case. Everyone else is allowed to say sorry and move on. Except for Steve.

#steve harrington #stranger things

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propinquum · 1 year

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Unashamed wish fulfilment thoughts

Thinking about a Superman AU (mostly based on Smallville) where his bio mother Lara was still pregnant when Krypton was being destroyed and Jor-El built the ship big enough for her and their unborn son to escape in, and she crash lands in the field in Smallville, where she's found by the Kents, who take her in, seeing a scared, traumatised, heavily pregnant woman, probably one who doesn't have a great grasp on English yet especially after the crash, but they help her because of course they have to.

And they end up living together, with Lara trusting them with her and her son's secret, and Martha and Jonathan at least know enough about midwifery through their lives on the farm and their own attempts to start a family to help her through the birth, maybe with some help from the ship.

And once he's born, they absolutely adore Clark (Lara probably ends up taking Jonathan's surname to sell a story that she's a cousin or other relation who came to Smallville to raise her son after her husband's death, and she'd have asked Martha and Jonathan for help picking an Earth name, and Kal-El would be his middle name most likely) and three sets of hands are better than one, and it's not like they have somewhere else to go.

Once she's recovered, Lara starts helping out on the farm and uses her training as a scientist to help improve their crop yields and predict weather patterns accurately with enough time to save Smallville from any particularly bad seasons.

Clark would grow up with three loving parents, learning both Earth and Kryptonian culture, still balancing his secrets and safety with the loss of the rest of his culture and extended family and finding himself and his destiny on Earth.

There would still be struggles too, for both Lara and Clark, because Lara hadn't been to Earth or been to a place with a yellow sun before, so she's having to figure out as an adult how to account for strength and speed and abilities far beyond anything she's experienced first hand, and having to teach her child this too at the same time.

And maybe she'd learn about the effects of the kryptonite meteors and try and study it, even though she can't be near it herself. Perhaps though, after losing so much already, she'd be far more reluctant to act and take risks than Clark eventually would grow to be.

There could be conflict there, with her and Martha and Jonathan and Clark all trying to find a balance between protectiveness and the need to help, to do good.

Lara hearing Lionel's abuse of his wife and child and finding a way to intervene, stopping Lillian from killing her newborn son, and taking Lex to the farm while his mother and Julian recover and get actual treatment with Lionel out of the picture, even though they still needed his help to get the documents forged for Clark and his mother, and that sword of damocles still hangs over them. Lex and his mother and baby Julian don't get to keep the mansion, but they get another nice house in town, and that's enough for the three of them, once the dust settles.

Lex and Clark becoming close friends quickly, and Lex finally getting that love and trust and space to thrive on the Kent farm that he'd never had in the mansion, and maybe finding out about Clark and his mother's abilities, but at that point, he's felt what a difference it makes being there, and he vows not to put them in danger. They're family. Better family than he ever thought he'd have.

Lex would still be curious and ambitious and he'd still have his own issues to work through, and Lionel probably wouldn't leave him be for long especially when Lex grows old enough to take his inheritance and start trying to properly rival Lionel's business interests, in Smallville and further afield.

He could still worry about Clark, and maybe there would be jealousy there about his abilities, curiosity about Kryptonians and their technology and the effects of Kryptonite on humans and Kryptonians alike, and try and turn those to his own advantage in the name of humanity's progress-- why hoard things that could save so many?

And Clark wants to help people, he saves people and intervenes where he can because he loves his home, the only home he's ever known, and sure sometimes he listens to his mother talk about Krypton and wishes he could have seen it, but it seems so cold and sterile in comparison to Earth, he would never choose it over Smallville. He still has a crush on Lana for ages, and maybe eventually realises he has feelings too for Lex, his first friend, and having to deal with that. Not just being not-human, but being queer, and what does that even mean for him? Especially since sexuality basically didn't exist in any social sense on Krypton and well, they live in a small town central US state that's not exactly the Most Progressive with that sort of thing. But his family isn't typical, neither is he, and he knows the world is larger than any prejudices people want to stake themselves to.

Martha and Jonathan and Lara would have a lot to balance together, and figuring out how they work together to raise their collective son, and maybe the ship still helps Martha conceive her own child too at some point, and they have another sibling added to the Kent household, along with Lex who's basically also theirs at that point. Which values do they focus on? What's most important to teach, to share? Where are the lines and limits?

The first time things go beyond cohabitation and compassion, Clark is staying at Lex's house for a sleepover, and the three adults are alone together for the first time in a while. They have a nice dinner, some wine, they try and talk about things besides the kids for a time, and realise both how much they love them but also wow being a parent is a lot. Where has the time gone?

And then Lara is crying, thinking about the very different life she might have had on Krypton, how much colder things were there in comparison to the warmth and life of Earth, how grateful she is that she could come here and find the two kindest people who took her in at her most vulnerable. And she still misses her husband, her family, her friends, but she has something so wonderful here, and then Martha and Jonathan are both holding her, comforting her.

Martha shares a look with Jonathan over Lara's shoulder and he gives her the soft smile she knows better than her own and then Martha kisses Lara, so gently it startles the Kryptonian, and Jonathan's fingers are running through her hair, and his lips are on her neck. She's reminded that she's part of their lives too, that they wouldn't change their choices the day the ship and the meteors crashed out of the sky. They love her. She's brought them joy they never thought they'd have. She's helped them so, so much, and they've basically been together for years now, they can't really think about not having their house the way it is. They don't even have to think about things day to day, they automatically know exactly which cup or mug to grab for each other, how they like their food made, their clothes, which ones are better at which chores, who will help catch something they're juggling without even having to be asked.

Adding more physical intimacy to the relationship isn't even that big of a step these days, since Lara has seen how much Martha and Jonathan love each other and the ways they express it, and maybe she has longed for that for herself too. And Clark already calls Jonathan his Pa or his Dad, Martha is Ma, or referred to collectively as one of his mothers. Everyone in Smallville is used to that already anyway-- he couldn't remember Aunt and Uncle when he was just a child, so he had two moms and a dad and everyone just chuckled lightly and said sure.

Honestly Clark would barely even notice the change, though he might grin and raise his eyebrows the first time Jonathan kisses both Martha and Lara on his way out the door to start work.

I just think this would be cute and would add some extra dimensions to Clark's life and would still drive him towards becoming Superman, but maybe things would be just a little better, there'd be less hurt, more ability to trust and grow their allies, develop enemies differently or arrive at the same destination by another route... It wouldn't fix everything, certainly, but there would be different problems to solve instead.

#smallville #clark kent #lara lor-van #idk this is just a lot of ramblings thinking about this AU #martha and jonathan kent

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increasinglygeeky · 2 years

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Uhhh. Stranger Things Season 4 VOL 1. thoughts

I'm conflicted about the whole Mileven/Byler dilemma b/c I've been a Mileven girl since the beginning but hey, whatever happens in Vol 2., happens.

Mileven deserves rights just b/c El has been through so much she needs to be happy no matter what when it's all over.

RONANCE BROMANCE HELLS YEAH!!!

why the fuck weren't Dustin and Steve being my fave funky duo of this show???...DUFFERS EXPAIN

LUMAX LIVES BITCHES!!!!

Eddie being my new fave skrunkly scrimblo

Why the f is no one talking about Fred?? (His name is deadass Fred Benson hehehe) What did he kill a bunch of people????

Also did they seriously force Nancy to go through the loss of TWO close friends in the span of 3 years???

Also Chrissy deserved better she was so cute

EDDIE AND HER COULDVE BEEN BFFS MAYBE EVEN MORE B/C I DOUBT THAT PRICK JASON ACTUALLY CARED ABOUT HER TO NOT EVEN SUSPECT ABUSE!!!

Robin is....diff in this season but I'll let that slide b/c she was adorable

I feel so bad for Lucas. Baby sacrificing all his healths to just help out his friends.

Still Anti-Billy. Just beacuse of his dad gave him NO right to treat Max the way he did.

Although the letter scene did hurt especially when you think about how much Max probably wanted a normal, big, family no matter what....

I also feel so bad for Jonathan he's probably going through so much internally if he's giving himself over to weed.

EL DESERVED TO BEAT ANGELAS FACE IN I SCREAMED YOU GO MY FUNKY LITTLE GIRLBOSS!!

ERICA MY OTHER FUNKY LITTLE GIRLBOSS NOW APART OF THE PARTY HELL YEAH WHAT A QUEEN SHE WAS THIS VOLUME.!

Love the look of how you communicate from the Upside Down its probably the only comforting thing there

Honestly I'm Argyle in THAT situation

Why did we stop the California plot line midway???

Suzie is so goddamn funny

Her family helping her out was the best ever

I feel like this season/volume dials up the comedy and it actually works

I nearly had a stroke when the boys were asking about the Internet.

You could've gave Will some friends of his own or something Duffers, gotdamn.

Why did they fuck up his role so bad??

At least he actually gives a damn about El.

Im so glad will and Jonathan do refer to themsleves as El's brothers its what she deseves.

El and Will being in sibling sync had me hollering.

Seriously Mike, wtf were you thinking with those letters???

Loving the Nightmare on Elm Street shoutouts and parallels it's my fave horror series.

THEY DEADASS GOT ROBERT ENGLUND HELL YEAH!!!

NO NO STEVE/NANCY ENDGAME ARE YOU KIDDING ME NO!!! HE LITERALLY WENT THROUGH HALF OF THE SERIES GETTING OVER HER FUCK OFF.

At least their interactions reminded of how much Natalia and Joe would be so good as Nancy Thompson and Glen Lantz in a proper Elm Street remake/reboot I'm frothing at the mouth thinking about it.

STEVE HARRINGTON STOP BEING SO HOT WHEN YOU'RE BEATING THE SHIT OUT HELL BATS HAIRY TIDDIES OUT AND SPITTING UP BLOOD!!

I am in desperate need of a reader fic where we react to Steve in that scene.

Max is strong...stronger than all of us.

Wait was it Vecna who killed Barb and not the Mind Flayer??

I felt SO BAD for El when they buzzed off her hair especially when you remember her commenting that Argyle's is longer than hers she probably wanted to grow it out for as long as she can.

The rope going through the Upside Down was chefs kiss.

At least we get a proper reason to why they call it the Upside Down.

When Hopper found the church and peanut butter I almost cried b/c that's obviously the most peace hes gotten in like a year.

JOPPER JOPPER JOPPER JOPPER JOPPPER REUNION WAS BETTER THAT MY EXPECTATIONS IM SO HAPPY MY PARENTS!!!!

DID VECNA TAKE WILL THIS WHOLE TIME!?!?

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