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forevercloudnine · 4 years

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arkhamverse riddlebat ship meme

(Continuing with the questions that @heroes-etc picked out for me, this set being from this ship meme.)

3. who is more afraid about the other leaving them?

Edward, hands down. Arkhamverse Riddler is maybe the neediest take on the character I’ve ever seen. Which is saying something, because the panel from “Questions Multiply the Mystery” where he writhes around on the floor begging for attention is permanently burned into my mind. He also clearly doesn’t take rejection well, as evidenced by the graffiti in his cell shown in a promotional image for Arkham Asylum (2009). J'ai aimé, j'ai souffert, maintenant... je hais. “I loved, I suffered, now I hate.”

It didn’t make it into the game proper (too subtexty, maybe, given a general lack of non-Batman people this could be referring to), but from my perspective it might as well have, since I experienced all the games second hand by sitting on the couch next to my brother while he swore at the Riddler challenges. Anyway, if perceived rejection has you writing French poetry on your cell wall in what looks concerningly like bodily fluids, then you probably won’t deal well with the concept of actually being dumped.

5. who is more likely to drunkenly confess?

Also Edward, given that he’s calling Bruce every five minutes. And if he’s not calling Bruce directly, he’s talking ABOUT Bruce in a public broadcast to all of Gotham. Eddie is the king of freudian slips sober, so one can only imagine what he would say in vino veritas. If he does get drunk, let’s hope for his sake that he opts to communicate through his private line to Batman rather than over every screen in Gotham.

6. who is more likely to push the other away (for any reason)?

Bruce, also hands down. Arkham Knight really goes out of its way to hammer in that Batman’s callous treatment of Riddler has wreaked havoc on Edward’s psyche, even if arguably Eddie had it coming. Riddler’s mole in the GCPD talks about this:

JT Walker: It used to be funny, you know [...] And then one day, it just wasn't funny anymore. It was pathetic. He stopped taking care of himself, got that crazy look in his eyes. I swear man, he's broken. You broke him.

Bruce’s subconscious gets a dig in on this topic via Joker hallucination.

“Joker”: Good for you, Bats! Eddie doesn’t need help. No, no, no. Beat ‘em up. Lock ‘em up. That’s the best medicine.

Even my brother, who would attempt to stab Arkhamverse Edward in the face War-of-Jokes-and-Riddles style if the games let him, felt guilty on Bruce’s behalf when Eddie started ranting about his photographic memory.

Riddler: I can summon your sneering features at will. That is, when they don't burst unbidden into my brain [...] I can remember every time you've hurt me. Sometimes I wake up, Dark Knight, to the feel of your hands around my neck, your carbon fiber created fists smashing my solar plexus.

I think because of this trait, one of the only ways this ship would work in Arkhamverse is if they came to an agreement during Arkham Origins (since Edward is... more or less... a vigilante in that game, albeit one that Bruce considers distasteful), well before their relationship gets to where it is in Arkham Asylum. The other way is if Bruce actually took the lesson Arkham Knight hammered over his head and tried to fix the damage done after faking his death. (In my mind there exists a many chaptered fanfic where after Batman “disappears” he moves to the second Batcave the games put under Arkham Asylum and takes on Joker’s “Eric Border” persona from the comics to become an orderly there. Whether it’s scarebat or riddlebat varies depending on my mood, but what’s consistent no matter what is that I have five WIPs on ao3 and I can’t write it until I finish at least one of them).

7. who picks fights more often?

Obviously Arkhamverse Edward is the most irritating person who has ever lived, so he kind of wins by default. But Bruce definitely holds his own in instigating unnecessary conflict with loved ones in this continuity. I’ll cut him some slack during Arkham Knight because one could argue that he spends most of the game half-possessed by an evil clown ghost, but it’s not like he’s much better in ANY of the other games. The bit in Arkham City where he lies to Talia’s face about being willing to spend the rest of his life with her so that she’ll give him access to the Lazarus Pit — even though if he was just honest and asked for it she probably would have helped him anyway, given that she DIES protecting him in the climax — is probably the best example of how he will infuriate people who love him for no logical reason. It’s a symptom of the post traumatic hyper vigilance, probably.

So if Edward did get the closeness to Bruce that his subconsciousness seems to be gunning for, he could look forward to the physical violence and public humiliation being replaced with the same well-intentioned gaslighting and emotional manipulation Bruce gives everyone but Alfred in these games. Actually, is Alfred the only one who’s even aware that he’s alive after Arkham Knight? Bruce, please tell your kids that you aren’t a pile of ash in the crater that used to be Wayne Manor.

9. who is more likely to withhold their feelings for the other?

The obvious answer is Bruce, because he keeps his emotions locked in a lead box buried like twenty feet beneath the floor of the Batcave (probably along with a bunch of kryptonite, since Superman is flying around the Arkhamverse somewhere). But honestly Bruce doesn’t seem to have a problem getting it on with supervillains in this continuity. He and Talia chat pretty casually about a recent romantic rendezvous in Metropolis when they meet in Arkham City. His emotional distance from Selina in Arkham Knight seems less like him withholding his feelings from her, and more like him not being over Talia’s death (or Joker’s, which... the narrative certainly focuses on more than Talia’s...).

So I think Edward would actually be more likely to withhold his feelings for Bruce. Even if Bruce approached him first, he’s too obsessed with the possibility of Bruce humiliating him to take any positive interaction (especially a romantic overture) at face value.

Riddler: You left me battered and demeaned in Arkham City. I am the Riddler, Batman. I don't suffer humiliation. I pay it back.

He’s not really wrong, either. Batman does humiliate him in Arkham City (by misleading Edward into thinking he’d let him die, no less); it’s the same embarrassment Edward inflicts on his own victims, so it’s not like he doesn’t deserve it per se, but it’s definitely not Bruce taking the higher ground.

Sticking him in his own trap is pretty vindictive, and Riddler’s weird commentary about not letting Batman have bathroom breaks during his revenge trials in Arkham Knight hints that Cash and the other guards might have made his (clearly unlawful!) punishment even more humiliating than we see on screen.

Riddler: Rule the seventh. Bathroom breaks will be administered on a discretionary basis. Should we find ourselves at a pivotal moment in your arduous journey to self-realization and defeat, I expect you to hold it in. Rule the eighth. Any accidents resulting from my strict enforcement of the seventh rule are to be considered your fault entirely.

So would Edward withhold his feelings for Batman? Yeah, probably. And it would probably take a lot of time and effort for Bruce to convince Edward that any feelings on his part weren’t just an attempt to humiliate Riddler further.

#riddlebat #edward nygma #riddler #arkhamverse #ship meme #every day #every day i think about the checkmate line

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whetstonefires · 6 years

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fictober prompt #11: “But I will never forget!”

“You win,” said the child.

“I win?”

“Yes. But I will never forget! My parents. Where I came from.”

“That’s fine?” He was aware he sounded less like the Dark Knight than the easily bewildered Lord Wayne, but he couldn’t seem to stop. Even if it wasn’t really easy to bewilder him, it could still happen, and it had. “It’s good, actually. I wouldn’t want you to.”

“Oh, right.” Dik Grayson folded his arms. “Because they’re why you want me.”

He winced a little. He hadn’t meant to give the impression by talking about the loss they had in common that if the young tumbler recovered from his grief he would lose interest in him. He hoped the edge of his temper would ease a bit, as time passed. His had, if only slightly, but then his parents’ killer never had been caught. He was hoping Zucco’s upcoming public trial would help. “That’s not exactly…”

“What they taught me. That’s what makes me valuable.”

“I would…say I value you for your own unique talents….”

“Stop it, I’m not stupid.” The child acrobat’s head dropped. Defeat and defiance mingled in every line of him. “I know what you did.”

Bruce was stumped. “And what did I do?”

The young face flashed up again, furious and covered in tears; he was weeping, but his voice didn’t catch at all. “You wanted me, so you got them out of the way!”

It felt surprisingly like being stabbed. “What?”

“Don’t think you’re the first one to try it! Everyone says, what a pretty little bird, I wish he were mine, and then some of the lords and ladies try to buy me. And some of you don’t like to hear no. You’re just the first one to pull it off.”

“It was Zucco. We proved it was Zucco.”

“Yeah.” The tears of fury were slowing, stemmed to bitterness. “Once I calmed down, I thought—that’s awfully convenient, isn’t it. It’s not like the circus sees that much coin, and we’re only here a few weeks at a time. It’s weird that a thief-king with that much pull would bother to set up such a fancy murder just to threaten old man Haley.”

“You…heard him confess, I’ve got him locked in the Tower of Justice awaiting trial right now—”

“Convenient!” The child repeated. “He’s out of your way and silenced as soon as he’s dead.”

“…We’ve abolished execution as a punishment in Gotham.”

Blink. Finally thrown off his stride. “Oh. Well, still! If you did it through an intermediary he won’t be able to point to you.”

“Dik. Dik Grayson, listen to me. I only wanted to help you. And punish a crime committed in my city. Those were my only motives.”

“Yeah? So why am I still here? Why not let me go with the rest of the Circus?”

Bruce took a bracing breath. At least he was getting to the root of the misunderstanding. “Legally, I couldn’t. None of them were your blood relatives, nor did they produce written proofs that your parents had willed you to their care.

“I wouldn’t normally enforce those rules on non-citizens unless someone was being hurt, but for Zucco to see justice you must give evidence at the trial, and once you are entered into the record as an unattached infant, protocol dictates that you must be found a legally responsible guardian. If I allow you to disappear, the case comes under suspicion for bad practice and possible conspiracy and may be overturned in the lower court on review, as your testimony will not be available but Zucco’s influence in the lower city will.”

This was rather more politics than he had intended to explain to an eight-year-old, but apparently if you didn’t tell children what was going on they cooked up elaborate paranoid fantasies.

…he’d been the same way, come to think of it. “I told you you would have to stay here in the city,” he reminded Dik, “if you wanted to see him brought to justice.”

The flea of a boy was goggling up at him. His eyes really were enormous. “I thought that was a bargain!”

“What?” Egad. Of course he had. Bruce pinched the top of his nose. “It wasn’t. Just a necessity.”

“So…if I go kill him now, you won’t need to try him. So then can I go?”

“If you go and kill him now I’ll have to put you in the Tower.” Bruce tried to keep his tone even. He managed not to pinch his nose again. He wasn’t really getting a headache, he just felt like he should be. “But…I don’t think you’re the kind who could kill a chained man in cold blood, Dik.”

The boy sighed. “No, you’re right. I couldn’t.”

They both stared at the paving stones between them. Thank goodness the child had chosen to do this in a private courtyard, where they shouldn’t have been overheard.

“So you’ll let me go?”

Bruce let out a long breath. “If you don’t mind the Zucco case falling through.” A caravan could only move so fast, and they’d only left yesterday; if he loaned Grayson a fast horse tomorrow morning Alfred could be back before dinner.

It would be a wrench, to have the thief-king slip this noose. It might be years before Bruce caught him so dead to rights again. But he wasn’t a tyrant. That was important. He wasn’t going to start stealing children against their will just to keep order in his own city.

The boy grimaced, torn between two unacceptable futures.

“You don’t have to stay with me, of course,” Bruce said. He’d considered it a bribe, at the time, though one that would profit him as well; hundreds of youths would be thrilled to be taken into his household, even as stableboys. But not everyone wanted the same things in life. “I could find you another guardian, if you don’t mind working for your keep, or you can go to the orphan’s house in the lower city. I hold it to strict standards,” he added, since this again probably sounded like a threat. “It’s clean, there’s as much food as you want, and no one will be permitted to beat you. They’ll keep you until you turn sixteen or find a trade.”

“I have a trade,” the boy grumbled.

Bruce winced again. He really had made a hash. Alfred was going to rake him over hot coals. “It’s not the done thing to bind a boy out to a master tumbler, but if you find one I’ll expedite the paperwork.”

“But still in your city.” Those huge blue eyes were narrow in calculation, drying, salt tracks beneath them white. “Under your control.”

“There’s a transfer system,” Bruce said. “At the orphan asylum. You’re a likely young lad, any city would—be happy to have you.” Want you, he’d almost said. Surely he’d chewed enough boot leather for the month already.

Please stay, he did not say. The place under his ribs that had felt so surprisingly stabbed was no longer joyful at the thought of having the boy close, but if he left now all of this had been for nothing. Just a dumb-show. A puppet play.

Dik Grayson’s fists were tremble-tight. Bruce’s knuckles ached with sympathy. “Will you swear.” The autumn-blue eyes were a thousand miles deep. “That you had nothing to do with it? Swear?”

“On my parents’ graves.” His most solemn oath, but hardly enough to a child who suspected him of dishonoring their memory so. “I neither wished nor brought nor condoned nor bought harm unto your blood or house. I swear it on my city’s future, on my honor, and the name of my house. May my blood turn to water and my tongue wither to dust if I lie.”

Once, the stories said, such oaths were not taken in vain, and one who swore falsely would suffer the penalty he named. Bruce made it a policy to always act as though that were still the case, but it wasn’t, and a man’s word of honor was worth only as much as the honor of the man.

But slowly, the boy nodded. And put out his hand. Bruce raised his eyebrows, but if the circus was old-fashioned in its manners so much the better. His hand enclosed Grayson’s whole forearm, while the small callused palm pressed barely above his wrist, but that changed nothing. “I’ll stay,” said the boy. “I promise by my name.”

“You didn’t have to,” Bruce said. It was one thing to ask an oath of someone you could bind in no other way. To take one from someone under your power, even without compulsion, seemed poor form.

Dik shrugged, and disengaged. “It’s even, like this.”

Not fair, because nothing between them really could be, the gap between Bruce’s power and his too absolute. But even. Because an exchange of promises was something you made with an equal. And the circus performers weren’t Bruce’s people. They didn’t answer to him, though his laws bound them within the bounds of his domain.

“You said I’ll need to earn my bread,” the child said, hands thrust deep into scarlet pockets. “I’m eight, so I figure that means scut-work. Nobody would trust me alone with geese yet, let alone pigs. If I stay with you, would you want me to perform?”

“Would you want to?” asked Bruce. Dik shrugged. “Of course you don’t want to lose your family trade,” Bruce allowed. “But if you stayed with me I rather thought I’d take you as an apprentice.”

It seemed silly now, the starry half-formed fantasies he’d had after running the rooftops with the child at his heels, perfectly coordinated and brilliant, silent as a bird on the wing.

And, currently, gaping. “What, at lording?”

“..if you like,” Bruce shrugged. “I haven’t any other.” It would put some hearts in Gotham to rest and unsettle some that needed it, and show certain parties what you got by pressuring a Wayne, even an affable and easily influenced one. “You’d probably be rather good at it.” The gaping had, if anything, grown worse. “But I meant at my other trade, in fact.”

Incredulity retreated a little, at this, and for the first time in this whole bedeviled conversation the boy seemed to brighten. “You’re serious.”

“Only if you’re interested,” Bruce said blandly. “I think my friend Sir Dent could use a message-runner, and Lady Kyle might need someone new to look after her cats, since you’re interested in animals…”

“Oh, shut up!” Dik clapped a hand over his mouth, and Bruce surprised even himself with an outright laugh.

“No, go ahead, please. It’s an important function of every member of my household to tell me when I’m being insufferable.”

And then the boy was smiling back at him. “You’re serious,” he said, settled this time, as he affirmed his trust.

“Mm. I’ll have you a knight inside ten years.”

The child laughed. “Me, a knight! What Mam would have said.” He waved a hand grandly, the gesture a little too large for the room even with his short arms; designed to be seen from a distance. “I’ll do it, of course I will. Obviously you need someone to translate you to normal people.”

“You’ll need to learn the law if you’re going to explain it to people,” Bruce pointed out, the flat stabbed place under his ribs starting, cautiously, to grow light again.

His new apprentice nodded, grinning confidence. “Every line.”

He put his hand out again—normally Bruce would formalize such an agreement with a parent, or whoever stood in place of one, but there was nobody—Master Haley had left the city already and, as Bruce had explained, under Gotham law had had no legal standing, though Bruce would have discussed this formally with the man as a courtesy if it had occurred to him.

They clasped forearms again, the size disparity no less ridiculous than before but less important, somehow. Bruce inclined his head with all due solemnity for the sealing of a contract. He didn’t want Dik to think ever again that he did not see him as an equal.

#fictober 2018 #bruce wayne #dick grayson #batfam #class issues #sort of an early-modern city-state AU?#power dynamics #orphans #apprenticeship #technically apprenticeship contracts were terms of indenture #so the way Bruce is framing this mentally is super ironic #fanfic #my fic #hoc est meum #infant historically was the technical term #we replaced it with 'minor'

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wizardysseus · 7 years

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if you're still doing the top five thing, top five superhero adaptations

ASK ME MY TOP 5/TOP 10 ANYTHING

adaptations to film/tv, i assume? like i can’t just list ultimate daredevil and elektra as my fave au and call it good?

captain america: the winter soldier

still in my top movies, full stop. when it came out i ran around campus trying to find my friends and begged them to go with me. i sat next to a friend who’s a very casual superhero fan herself (stays out of fandoms) and made her laugh because whenever she looked over i was, like, clawing at my own face. i cried pretty solidly on her shoulder through the credits?? i believe @a-corndog-named-schibbs was there, too, and should be able to attest. later i read the source material, which got me into other cap and winter soldier comics, which made me into the bitter bucky stan you know and love.

it’s just… a dang good film. it’s suspenseful and funny and heartfelt and sad and hopeful, and every time i watch it, i leave feeling a little more the way “trouble man” sounds.

batman: the animated series

this is just my opinion which is correct, but kevin conroy is the best batman. The Best. if such classic and unbeatable performances as this weren’t enough, there’s also mark hamill’s iconic joker, og harley, the al ghuls, and the rest of the gotham rogues. btas has absolutely hysterical episodes like “almost got ‘im” (the rogues wonder who invited joker to their weekly poker game), “harley’s holiday” (i personally award her a gold star that says You Tried A Little Bit), and “the man who killed batman” (kazoo eulogy. that is all anyone needs to know.) — and then it brings the emotion of two-face’s origin, mr. freeze’s tragic love story, and bruce being trapped in a dream where his parents are alive. i love the theme song. i love the old school gotham vibe. i love my weird loser family of villains who cannot function without an aesthetic. i love everyone in this bar

x-men: days of future past

another of my top movies, not just for the sheer delight i have in anything to do with time travel. i’ve watched it again, uh, a lot, and i will say its flaws bother me more now than they did the first time. but charles’ and raven’s character arcs still hold up, and that’s the core of why the film matters to me. charles struggling to confront his intensely painful empathy (well, telepathy, but in a narrative sense, empathy). logan telling him to form the x-men — even if it does all go to hell someday, still bring the family together. raven paving her own path, making mistakes, but wanting to do the right thing; eventually choosing mercy over vengeance, and it saves her people in the present and the future. that was powerful for me.

i also love that when they send logan back they’re like “ideally charles would go, but you’re the only one who can make the trip, so have fun.” and then everyone in the past goes “wow, you were the exact wrong person for this job” and logan nods good-naturedly like “thanks, i’m aware”

the dark knight rises if i’m being real

i have my bones to pick with nolan, i do (cough whitewashing the al ghuls cough)! but !!! BUT !!!

tdkr was the movie that finally hooked me on batman. i enjoyed the other two films — the heavy-handed philosophical drama of nolan’s whole trilogy really works for me, which made it a good intro. but tdkr specifically did something beyond that. nolan!batman gets a lot of shit for being too dark, too gritty, too scary. but tdkr is about the reversal of those things — truth and its consequences, hope, sacrifice, and hard-won rest. it’s practically eucatastrophe. and i’m just glad there’s a universe where bruce retired with selina and is at peace. i only want the best for him, you know?

besides, the track “why do we fall?” alone could get it on the list. thanks hans

wonder woman (2017)

there was a time in my life before i saw this movie 3 times in 6 days, but thank god, better times have come.

diana means a lot to me, as a character. she’s one of the first i called “my wife” and meant it (i think the others were claire temple and avatar korra? so that should tell you something about me). i didn’t need the movie to be flawless, but i needed something genuine to who she is. like her, the film is genuine, tender, badass, and philosophical. maybe humanity doesn’t deserve all of that from her, but she loves them us anyway, because her conviction lies with love itself. that message is close to my heart, and despite a misstep with her backstory, it’s very diana.

i also happened to see the film (the first time) with the same Extremely Casual Fan friend i took to catws, and once again cried on her through the credits. she is good to me.

honorable mentions

batman returns

logan

before s2 came out i would have said netflix daredevil, and i do still love the first season, but i’m also Betrayed™, so y’know. that said:

daredevil 2003 (it’s the worst movie ever, i’ve seen it twice this year)

#nativehueofresolution #ask #thoughts #long post

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